I had to get the hell out of the university. I was going to get the, you know, I was graduating in June and then I was out. I’d have my diploma go back to California and sit around with your parents or you know, find something else to do. So Crowcroft came out to the National Zoo and visited John and he was all, you know, Mr. Personality and very likable and debonair and humorous. And he had the right kind of Eisinger Eisenberg said, you know, this guy’s got a interesting career, you know, he wrote this book on shrews and he wrote this other book Mice All Over. I said, this is, this guy’s kind of a powerhouse, you know, he’s, he’d be a good person to work for. You know. So then they invited me to go to Chicago and I remember I put on two pairs of socks ’cause it was wintertime and I had all these layers of clothes on.
