They’re the only ones in captivity, but the one that you’ve got at the zoo and the one that Ms. Wall owns in her ranch in Kona. Let’s set up a captive breeding population of the nene. Because until we have control of the population that we’re not doing our job to protect this resource. And it’s my job as part as head a fish and game, protecting natural resources of Hawaii is part of my responsibility. So will you help me do it?” And I said, “Sure.” So he had a wildlife biologist at the time that he just employed a new biologist named Don Smith. So Don and Vernon, and I, went over to see Herbert Chipman, the rancher on the big island. Now this rancher was harrassable. He’d been described by an author as harrassable, negative, argumentative, arrogant, such terminology as that.
