They certainly, it existed in the culture, the politic, the whole nature of San Francisco. And I remember having a conversation with Saul, I mean, talking about the what’s like working at the zoo and working for the city and all the what’s about, and he was explicit in talking about it and saying that you can’t talk about it. You have to come here and experience, he couldn’t put it into words. And to this day, I subscribe to that, that was over 35 years ago, the city still has its uniqueness. That maybe could only similar to Berkeley in terms of how it treats people and it thinks of people and what people can do and what actions could get done. But to this day, it means a very progressive city, but I did take the job. I was happy, I started here in March. I started there in March of 1979 and it was truly a learning experience.
