I was associate director of conservation. They had an associate director of education, I think that was Dave Jan, Dave Jenkins came in. So that’s how it worked in those days. So I became, I was had a higher, I got a higher grade when that happened. And, but it was the same op, same program, but it was becoming more sophisticated and, and we were really figuring out what conservation was and what we could do for conservation. Whereas those first few years when we were there, we were just stuck building fences and renovating old barns and, and moving the animals in. And that was, that phase was over then. And we moved on to the next plateau.
