Well, I mean, you know, the problem that we had in those days, still do some degree have today, but (muttering), the level, you know, the depth and level of our, of our ignorance of the things that we didn’t know was, was incredible. It was pretty profound. Walked into the door, right into the face of a tuberculosis outbreak in the great apes. They’d had some gibbons that came down with tuberculosis and then it had spread. And so we had a great ape collection of, of gorillas, Colo, you know, Mack and Millie and Colo and Mongo, the gorillas and, and chimpanzees and orangs and gibbons, that the whole collection was basically tested positive for tuberculosis. So that was a, you know, that was a big, a big, immediate, immediate challenge in those days, the, you know, the immobilizing drugs that we’ve got today and the equipment and the techniques that we’ve got today didn’t even exist. Up until, up until about the time I got to the Columbus Zoo. Nicotine sulfate was the, you know, the only immobilizing agent that existed other than if it was an animal that you could use a barbiturate on.
