And so apparently the three together were having all kinds of difficulties. And Saunders, who published all kinds of medical textbooks, realized this just wasn’t gonna work. And at that point, Bob Altman said, “The heck with it, I’m going to publish my, I can do books by myself,” and same happened with the reptiles, and he went and published it separately, and so it was just Joel Wallach left. And at that point, Joel was no longer in the zoo business, and so they felt he didn’t have the, I guess credentials to be able to do it. And they talked, but he really was a brilliant person and very good, published a lot of stuff. And they went to Joel and said, “You have to have another co-author, and who would you be able to work with?” And Joel is a brilliant individual, but maybe doesn’t have the best personal skills sometimes. And so he, for whatever reason, he had worked with me when I was a student and he put my name down. And I hesitated a lot.
