Well, I think that one of the people who really taught me a lot about chimpanzees and great apes was Pat Sass. And Pat was a wonderful person. She had a fount of knowledge about the great apes. She had raised dozens of gorilla, orangutan, chimpanzees. The chimpanzees were her love and they knew her, and she was mom and they knew her. And she would absolutely was someone who schooled me in the right and wrong, kind of took me under her maternal wing. And for some reason, which was wonderful. It was interesting because the women in the Children’s Zoo who were the zoo, you know, they didn’t like a lot of competition from the women.
